Interview with Krishna
The moment I saw Krishna’s radiant face, I experienced an utter bliss. Wow! An epitome of happiness, love and beauty. As my gaze turned towards his attire, I was perplexed for a while…. What? Krishna in a pink colored pajama with a blue colored t-shirt.
Krishna was engrossed in watching the world cup cricket on a LCD T.V – A classic India-Pak match.
“Pranam and good morning” I said. Krishna looked at me. His pleasant face beamed with a disarming smile.
He said “Hey, you…come on in…Sit down, Uday…” I sat down.
There was no chair – just a grass-mat. What a contradiction – Modern LCD and grass mat.
A sudden roar in TV. Sachin hit six. Krishna was very happy, jumping and applauding. Just like a kid.
Then after sometime, one ball came hurling from Pakistani bowler and Sachin was out.
Again, Krishna jumped up and applauded.
I got both annoyed and confused.
“Sir, are you with India or Pakistan?” I asked with an edge in my voice.
“I don’t take sides; I just enjoy the game…” Krishna smiled. Then asked me: “How come I am a ‘Sir’ today…You used to call me just Krishna”
“Sir, it is out of respect”
“I prefer love to respect…” again that disarming smile.
“Ok, can we start?”
“Of course, what would you like to have? Butter or a glass of milk?”
“This morning time? I prefer to have tea…”
Suddenly, a steaming cup of hot tea appeared in front of me. What an aroma!
“Ha ha…just a magic trick…don’t drink it…it just happened in your sankalp…”
“I guessed so” I wanted to hide my embarrassment.
“Don’t lie to me…I can see a thought before it comes to you…So don’t even think of manipulating yourself…I am ok even if you feel angry at me…” Krishna assured.
“Ok Krishna…you said, you don’t take sides…you mean to say you don’t support good people?”
“Two persons coming to me…a thief and a policeman…thief wants to steal something solid and policeman wants to catch the thief…whom shall I support?”
“Of course, the policeman…”
“Prima facie, right. But if the thief’s situation is pathetic and policeman is very corrupt?”
“Then, the thief”
“See – you are not sure and you are blaming me. Please do not evaluate anything based on your perception of truth; there are many more dimensions in life..I can’t take a side…everything, everybody has a purpose in the universe…it is all in existence…your assumption of good and bad is just your perception” (I remembered, Krishna never takes side, but was with Padavas as they were on the path of establishing the rule of the righteous)
“But you said in Gita that you would support good karma…”
“Yes – I definitely will. But that doesn’t mean I would support your version or concept of good karma. Your concept derives from your conditioning. And most of your concepts and perceptions are based on the inputs received from society, community or religion that you are from…Your right and wrong may not be that of mine. Socially right may not be cosmically right. Society is your creation.”
“Hmmm…But you promised that you would come back when the dharma chyuti (Dharma = the principle of cosmic order; Chyuti=destruction) happens…”
“From where should I come back? Where have I gone? I am here and now. You have seen me – lots of people are seeing me every moment…”
I paused for a moment.
“But in the Bhagawat Gita, you have promised….”
“Did you read it?”
“Did you understand it?” the tone of the question is not arrogance. It’s love.
“I think so…”
“But I don’t think so…the questioner was Arjuna, and the answer was to Arjuna or whoever has a subtle ego…I told him the situation won’t change, your attitude towards the situation should change…”
“Did his attitude change?”
“Yes, of course, the situation was the war-field in Kuruksetra – it didn’t change before or after I revealed Gita to him. But Arjuna’s attitude to the situation has changed…that’s what needed. All situations are provided. Why should you try to change or resist the situation? Accept it as is and then, respond or change your course of action, if you want…”
“That’s true…er..But I have a doubt…The Gita has at least 745 verses. Even if it takes one minute to read one verse, it will take 745 minutes = 12.41 hours. All those in the battlefield stood still till then?”
“No…I had sent Gita as ZIP file to Arjuna’s conscious. It’s beyond your knowledge and logic. Your science is yet to evolve and will take few more hundred years to reach that stage. You can now talk to somebody in USA over wireless connections. If you tell this to people who lived 100 years ago, would they believe it?”
I thought about it. Our ancestors told us many things through scriptures. But we try to analyze them based on our conditioning and our scientific logic and then we ridicule them.
“Krishna, you appear very different…”
“Different from what?”
“I thought you would be wearing that peacock feather and holding flute…I am confused…”
“Do you think I am a drama artist or ballet dancer? I am for real. I move along with time…”
“So those photographs and pictures I have seen…”
“Photographs? Idiot, photography was not invented during my time. Somebody might have duped you using Photoshop”
“Sorry, I mean to say picture…”
“That is concept of an artist or painter. Anybody is free to think the way they want to…Why, do you want to see me according to your concept based on your conditioning…”
“I would be more comfortable with that…”
Suddenly Krishna’s form changed. Krishna appeared as per the age-old concept that we have of him. I prostrated full length in front of him.
Again, Krishna changed form. I understood – Krishna is like pure water – it doesn’t have a shape or taste of its own. It takes the shape of the vessel. If you add sugar, water will taste sweet.
– Krishna can take any form when ‘dharma chyuthi’ happens and emerge as anything or anybody. We have wrongly interpreted Krishna’s promise.
“Now, you have to break your concepts, Uday. I am there everywhere in every form…why do you want to limit me to a small picture so that you yourself will also be limited to…” Krishna asked. “Break your concepts dude…To hell with conditioning…”
“Hell? So there is a hell, isn’t it?” I asked.
“No wonder, you are a real buddhu who wants to be Buddha,” Krishna knocked in my head and asked: “is anybody home?”
I didn’t reply.
“Dude, I was using a modern English phrase…you are too orthodox…Please try to move along with or ahead of time, otherwise time will perish you. Hell and heaven are here and now. You can make it or mar it”
“Ok, I understand…Krishna, but are you not seeing this? Today’s world – it is full of chaos…lot of violence, corruption, unethical practices, inhuman mind…”
“Oh, my…you didn’t read my history in Jaya and other books?”
“Oh, it was the original version of your Mahabharata…You know, that old chap Ved Vyas had edited it well…”
“Yes, I have read it”
“Your time is far better than that of my avatar period…..” Krishna said, “During the time of my previous avatar, Rama, there were more monstrous people – like Ravan. The Lankan king has snatched Rama’s wife…In my time, oh my God, I was really fed up fighting with those asuras everyday. Even my own uncle Kamsa was a very dangerous guy. Every moment of living was struggle some…but that’s life – you have to be happy in struggle. In fact, Uday, your period is better than the olden days.”
I was confused.
Krishna gazed at me from the corner of his eyes and said: “Of course, except for those politicians who would sell the whole asura gana for half price and eat discounted break-fast with that money”
“But there was satya (truth) and dharma during your period”
“See, there was one Mr. Paundrak tried to impersonate me. Adharma (=that which is not in accord with the law) and asatya (=lies) were there during that period too… And, even now there is truth…only those who seek truth will see it…But there was a difference in terms of numbers…During that period most of your ancestors were seeking truth and happiness. In today’s world, you are comfortable with blind belief. They don’t seek truth. They don’t seek happiness….They mistake enjoyment, comforts and pleasure for happiness”
“So, it is difficult to see the truth or experience your presence?”
“A believer can never be a truth seeker. For him/her, belief is ultimate and there is nothing to seek. As far as real truth seekers are concerned (that could be only less than one percent of the population) only one among millions would earnestly will seek the truth and one or two among them will experience me…As long as you have a conditioned-mind filled with concepts it would be difficult to reach or realize me.”
“You mean to say – you don’t need brain to experience you”
“Correct – that’s why you are seeing me now…”Krishna laughed.
“No – I mean to say people can see you through heart, not through brain…”
“Correct. In between I will make random appearances in front of people, who don’t have minimum common sense or intellect…”Krishna smiled.
“I know you are hitting at me Krishna…” I told him.
“Krishna you always smile…what’s the secret?”
“I am thoughtless…if you do your karma properly with a smile in your face, you can also become like me….”
“Ok…But, seriously, today’s modern world has more stress and strain…”
“It’s a popular misconception that stress is a creation of modern life style. Even during pre-historic period human beings experienced stress in the form of fear…but, as I said, in ancient India, people were seeking truth and real happiness…Now, they think that pleasure, enjoyment and comfort could provide them happiness”
“Why such a difference between olden period and current days”
“During those times, people shared and cared for each other. They used to gather and make merry for every occasion. They sang and danced out of joy and played musical instruments. They cooked and ate together. Today, your sole idea of enjoyment is limited to watching idiot box like this and drinking alcohol…”Krishna laughed again. “And during those times, population was less. Pollution was less. Now you are more polluted in your body and mind…”
“Isn’t it bad?”
“How come? Everything has to come to an end, right? If you don’t have any illness, how will you die? If you don’t die, how will you take care of your karma cycle?”
“Hmm…Bit complicated. Who is it?” I pointed out to a small statue on the LCD stand.
“Oh, Laughing Buddha? He also is an avatar only”
“Why is he still laughing?”
“Somebody cracked a joke in his childhood”
“A God has sent a messenger to him. The messenger told Buddha: ‘Worship this God otherwise you would be roasted in hell’, since then he began laughing and never stopped” Krishna also laughed out loud.
“So you crack jokes?”
“Why not? We Gods have jokes on all astrologers or few doctors. When they open their mouth or if somebody plans (as if they can) the future our (God’s) our comedy time begins”
“That’s a good one” I said. Then asked: “Is it true that you have married thousands of females?”
“Hmmm, are you feeling jealous?”Krishna laughed. What a beauty!
“Again, a lie – your are lying. Just now you thought like this – even your cousin Arjuna had few wives – Poor Uday, who shares Arjuna’s birthday’…Didn’t you think that?”
I didn’t say anything. This thief (of hearts) is too much.
“In today’s world I can see men spending lot of time in searching for the small print of expiry date in marriage certificates…In our days it was not so. Marriage was not a pre-paid voucher which can be scratched and availed for divorce later. Marriage was considered divine. For your information, we were capable of loving and supporting more than one wife. We gave equal support to all. But thousands – it is too much of an exaggeration. See, that time, we had to face lot of battles. Our warriors would die. Who will support their wives? So, I told them, I will take care of all, the way I take care of my wife. That’s all. There were crooked people with a mind-set of today’s media persons. They cooked up sensational stories…”
“That was very nice of you Krishna…”
“What’s more, I had to finish the evil king, Narakasur, who kidnapped lot of princesses from all over the world. All of them were raped and abused. I declared all the victims of Narakasur should be treated as equal to my wives, to save them from disgrace. Even during that time, the society was considering rape as a fault of the woman…”
“So, you agree that you had at least 4-5 wives…”
“Eight, to be precise….still I survived!”Krishna laughed and said: “Dude, during my time the number of males were less because of those battles and a huge chunk will go to forest for meditation and seeking wisdom. So it was a social compulsion…But we respected women during those times…”
“But it was a male-chauvinist society…”
“On the contrary, it was a society based on equality. We created Varna, based on work so that each and every karma is respected. Varna was not based on birth. Any good idea, if institutionalized, will turn to be a source for exploitation and corruption. Everywhere – be it a country, religion or political ideology- this happens. Caste discrimination was non-existent in the ancient time. You manipulated the Varna system and created caste. I knew that in Kaliyuga people would follow wrong caste system, so to uphold value of women, we still made it clear in most of our scriptures that if somebody asks your caste, you should tell mother’s caste, and not father’s…..”Krishna paused for a while, winked at me and asked: “According to current social system, I am eligible for OBC reservations, right?”
“Yes- your caste, the yadav, comes under OBC (Other Backward Classes) category now…” I said.
“Very good…ok, you asked about the females’s position in Bharat. The status of a female was much higher than even God…Matha (mother) comes first in the list. And the position of God comes later…We never had a male-chauvinist society in this Bharat till recently. It came along with other superstitions like caste, wrong rituals, unholy customs, astrology etc. It is the way of life in Kaliyug.”
“In fact, I wanted to ask you more about the caste system and the women’s status – what an irony – you taught sweet things, but they follow all rubbish things in your name”
“Ignorance Uday, ignorance. Ignorance causes desire. Desire manipulates the mind and then the society. If you want to study about the caste system, reflect on this: Maharshi Krishna Dvipayana Veda Vyas, the greatest genius ever appeared in the earth, was son of a fisher woman Matsyagandha. And he was father to Dhritarashtra and Pandu – so everybody in Mahabharat belongs to Shudra caste only, going by mother’s caste or even father’s caste….”
Suddenly, it struck me in my mind – most of our rulers were Shudras! The greatest emperor ever ruled Bharat, Chandragupta Maurya, was son of Mura, daughter of a Vrishala (Shudra). The dynasty was known in mother’s name: Maurya Empire! So major emperors in India were shudras! Not Kshatriyas. Later we classified them as Kshatriyas based on their karma, not by birth. Then, the Middle East invaders and oppressors attacked India, ruled India, destroying India’s great culture heritage. Caste system was manipulated by external forces (foreign rulers) to exploit our country. The idea of divide and rule applied here. Later, even after Independence, our own people – politicians/rulers followed the same path of invaders and colonialists and continue exploiting the people of this country in the name of caste and religion. We got separated as water-tight compartments based on caste and religions. This happening is part of Kaliyug. These thoughts might have uploaded to my mind.
Krishna just smiled without any comments.
“Krishna, I want a help from you”
“Nothing comes free in this world,” Krishna warned and asked, “I can see your thoughts….you are scared of death…”
“That really is fear of death in disguise…”
“Whatever, can you give me a boon…?”
“Only fools will ask for boon…”
“In olden days, warriors undergo lot of penance to get a divine weapon. When somebody gets Nagastra (Sanskrit: Astra = weapon, especially, one thrown at an opponent; Nag=snake), then his enemy would get Garudastra (Garuda=eagle that eats snakes). When Mr.A prays for Agnyestra (Agni=fire, the weapon is used for setting the enemy ablaze), his opponent Mr.B will pray for Varunastra (Weapon used for extinguishing flames, or for invoking floods)….They get it…but what use? Every weapon will be neutralized by opposite weapon. Every action is equal and opposite. So if you get a boon, then an equal and opposite bane can happen, which is beyond the comprehension of your mind…So, don’t be an idiot to ask for any boon…”
“You mean to say, prayers for boons won’t work?”
“You won’t get a yes and no answer for anything. You are just a silly-minded kindergarten kid who seeks answers in black and white. Answers are for questioner and not for question. So there is no generalized answer. Prayer works – sometimes. Definitely, at a mind level. It will give your mind a greater solace. But beyond that – no, I can’t say it won’t work, lots of other factors are dependent on it.”
“So if I pray for ayur-arogya (health and longevity), it is of no-use?”
“Kiddo, I have already instructed in Gita how to live healthy. You don’t want to follow it and you just want pray and get it as a boon – you need benefits without work-out. That won’t happen, lazy bum.”
I kept mum.
“But why do you want to live more? A few more days or years in your life – will it make any difference in cosmic? In your body, at least one billion cells take birth and die every day. Do you feel any difference? If one cell is not dying in time and begin reproduction or a cell dies pre-maturely, it can even cause cancer and pain, right? So leave it yaar…let us be happy till we die and more happy after death, as we can move around more freely and have fun…Even Sun has a life-expectancy, just a few more millions of years than your life-expectancy”
“You have a point here…But you see most of the people pray for many things…”
“I know. They even offer me bribe. Just now I heard a prayer. This chap has taken a lottery ticket with a prize-money offer of Rupees 1 crore (ten million). He is offering me 1 lakh (hundred thousand) if he wins it…Can’t I take the whole 1 crore, if I want? What kind of raw-deal is it?”
“Krishna, you know people pray for personal benefits only…I also do like that”
“Uday, you are a funny guy – Why do you need individual happiness? If you are happy and all your family members, friends and the society are unhappy, can you really be happy? Look, I have already taught you a universal prayer few thousand years ago: ‘loka samastha sukhino bhavathu’ (May all beings be happy)… One’s happiness shouldn’t be other’s sadness…And more importantly, you can’t get something that is inherent in you. Your state of being is happiness – you are ignorant about it and searching it externally. The real happiness is also contagious. You will experience happiness when you see a real happy person…”
“Now I am experiencing that…”
“Hmmm, trying to flatter me, eh? I told you I can see a thought before it enters your mind…”Krishna smiled at me. What a beauty! Every move of Krishna is sweet and graceful.
“Krishna, I have lot of questions…”
“Shoot…I am here to answer it…” Krishna smiled. I took my pen.
Suddenly Krishna put his arm around his left ear, the same way we humans hold the mobile phone. Then he told me: “One minute please – it is an urgent call from Shiv, my best friend…” Oh, gods do not need any cell phone to communicate, I thought… (End of first chapter)
This is first chapter of the Interview. For those who came late, I request you to read these articles (click here) : Do you Believe in God, Why should GOD be insecure, Are you enlightened, Why do bad things happen to good people, Am I a Hindu etc. Please also read : 18 February – 5115 years after Krishna’s bodily departure!
Let’s share and care. Let’s get connected:
WhatsApp Number: +919447533409
Twitter: Udaylal Pai
Book: Why Am I a Hindu (The Science of Sanatan Dharma). For kindle and international paperback, please visit: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N9PAGLT For Indian paperback (print) edition only: http://prachodayat.org/why-am-i-a-hindu/
© Uday Lal Pai. Please contact the author for re-posting or publishing at email@example.com